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Thread: Why?

  1. #1

    Why?

    There are a myriad of technologies that have been developed over the ages. This forum showcases the trials & errors, and successes of participating experimenters. On one hand, if everyone held close their discoveries, chances are they would die & take their knowledge to their grave (which sadly has happened way too many times); or someone in the elite class might take notice & knock that inventor out (or at least scare him/her to silly, which has also happened way too many times!). There is another consideration; someone is trying to develop a commercial product and doesn’t want to give it all away by sharing secrets(?!?!?!?!?).

    So, the question is: Why would someone expend the time & financial resources to experiment just for the sake of experimenting?

    Why would someone share their successes (failures are shared to gain answers in hopes of more fruitful future successes)?

    Why should someone wanting to develop a commercial product share successes?

    I know that Walt Jenkins went on stage and shared knowledge, but held much information back from his audience. He wanted to encourage experimenters, but didn’t want to divulge his personal high-level successes (which he hopes to commercialize in the future).

    There are many technologies that are explained within the A&P family with a Part 1, Part 2, Part n version. In some cases, new knowledge is learned and a newer version is required. In other instances, low-level knowledge is divulged in Part 1; spend more money & learn better stuff provided in Part 2, etc.

    I have been experimenting for almost 30 years, have had some successes, have been heralded as a “genius” within various groups, wrote some books & articles… I currently have several things I think are worth something and have questions. Please chime in. I DO want to commercialize my ideas, but I also want to contribute to (and help) folks of like mind.

  2. #2
    Hi Mike,

    I don't have your experience or knowledge in this field, am not stating anything that’s not obvious nor strictly sticking to your questions, but...

    In a just world, to have put in the time, energy, money, etc. to develop or discover something of benefit to humanity and life on earth - as I’m sure you have - one would be able to bring it to fruition in the marketplace; to be justly compensated while making a positive contribution.

    In the age we’re living in though, to honestly assess the likelihood of commercial success, one needs to factor in the element of suppression. It's the elephant in the room.

    If one tries to commercialize anything that allows users to have more independence, increases decentralization, doesn’t fit the scarcity/limited resources model, doesn’t serve the interests of the military, reduces surveillance and control of the masses, or which interrupts the gravy train of an established industry - one will encounter obstacles bringing that device to market.

    On the other hand…everything is cyclical. Winter, however dark and cold, is followed by Spring. As the poet Pablo Nerudo so eloquently put it, “You can cut all the flowers but you cannot keep Spring from coming.” Who knows when the dam will break, or what role you might play in that process, so you may still want to go for it in spite of the odds. Nature is obviously bigger than humanity and we’re part of it and have our role to play in that larger context. Deeper forces move us.

    Perhaps part of your role in this life - in spite of the frustrations and hardship that may come as a consequence - is to be a candle in the darkness. Of course seeing from a larger context doesn’t necessarily pay the bills, which is partly what your post is about.

    So I hope you can achieve commercial success, but want to suggest that you also look at other ways of sharing what you’ve discovered. Perhaps something like what Hope Moore, Tivon and Aaron are all doing - focussing more on selling information than the disruptive technology itself.

  3. #3
    Networking Architect Aaron Murakami's Avatar
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    I did that for years way before I was in any business related to any of this. Lots of money spent on an obsession because it is satisfying. Some people have hot rods, some people are into high-end biking, you name it - this was just on my path like many others here - at least one of various hobbies. As far as people spending money on experimenting - I don't know about others but before I was involved with any business with any of this, it was simply a passion/obsession. My path was simply because I was seeking knowledge for the sake of knowledge itself. It was a hobby and I got a lot of satisfaction out of building something that worked - it's a sense of accomplishment. Even when things didn't work, I still learned something. I knew years before I met Bedini that I would be involved with all of this - I just didn't know how it would play out or who would be involved. The business wasn't planned like this but it just materialized like a massive blessing - of course a lot of hard work but the root of it all for me was just seeking knowledge.

    John Bedini - one example of contributing to the learning of others while keeping a balance of being able to reap the rewards for your work is the Bedini SG. John had the claims patented, he openly supported others building the circuits to learn, while reserving commercial applications to himself. The SG is probably the single most replicated device in this entire field ever, in many respects, it changed many people's lives, and he put the concepts of the SG into some of the commercial chargers.

    Paul Babcock did the same with the circuits his company patented. Fastest switching technology around that uses solid state but mimicks a real analog make/break switch. Hardly anyone ever replicated it, but he shared and disclosed the concepts while his company retained the rights to do anything commercial with it. Initial commercial application was lighting control circuits for ballast driven bulbs - can give about 90% of the brightness for around 50% of the energy while doubling or more the lifespan of the bulbs.

    I didn't invent the plasma jet ignition - been around since about the 70's. I just came up with what many consider the simplest and most eloquent method for accomplishing it with an off the shelf CDI using the cap simultaneously as the coil input for a higher voltage spark plus using the same cap as the low voltage source to jump a gap. The "experts" said that was impossible to use the same cap for both, but obviously, they were all wrong. I initially placed all of my experiments into Energetic Forum. When I wrote a book to condense everything into a simple A - Z, I searched for someone's name to make sure I spelled it right for the dedication page and the first thing that comes up is a patent application with MY circuit and 3 other people's names on it that had nothing to do with my very specific method! After an aggressive response to them including their lawyer, I was eventually put on the patent for my invention. There are 2 other inventions on the patent that I had nothing to do with. In any case, the books/videos if someone doesn't want to spent hundreds or more hours on sorting through everything I freely posted in Energetic Forum 10 years ago, shows everyone how to do it all and I retain commercial rights.

    These are 3 examples of helping others with the info while reserving the right to commercialize the inventions. There are quite a bit more, some with patents and some without.

    If you have something that can be kept proprietary, then you could manufacture them - pot the circuits so it makes it at least difficult for others to figure out the circuit and you can teach the principles if you think people are interested. Teaching principles involved are infinitely more valuable in my opinion than people getting hooked on exact circuits. The reason is that the obsession with exact circuits leads to dependence. When people learn the principles involved and they have the wherewithal, they can create the same results starting from scratch because you just make a circuit or whatever do "THAT", which is to be replicated - whatever it happens to be. Not that I'm against sharing circuits, but too many people that have them are also fixated on their particular path to a solution, which is exactly what a circuit happens to be.

    I hope Walt wants to share more as well, but it's his technology so I have no place making any demands. Anyone wanting to share something I want to help get it out and if someone wants to maintain whatever privacy, I'll always respect that.

    If you want to share, at minimum, what category are the things you mention that you'd like to commercialize, but also help those who are like minded?
    Aaron Murakami





    You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete.” ― Richard Buckminster Fuller

  4. #4
    For one, I like to say, "I'd have to get 100 MPG for 100 years to get an ROI on what I spent learning how to get 100 MPG." I started out as a "car guy" who had to learn electronics, out of necessity, due to the massive reliance on electronics in modern automobiles. Over the last decade I transformed into an "electronics guy" that happens to have a fondness for cars.

    As for what I've learned over the past 2+ decades (not quite 30 years yet), much about the history of fuel economy, the players, their methods, their stories, and the politics. I experimented with fuel vapor systems. I got heavily involved with Paul Pantone in the late 90's, and was President of GEET for less than a year (1999). Later I was involved with Dennis Lee's HAFC HHO program. Since then I have spent much effort on refining HHO production, regulation, and quality enhancement. I explored PDI ignition; yet I run a mostly stock ignition on my vehicle (can't keep spark plugs in it otherwise). Some of my biggest bragging rights come in the form of electronic controls. Aside from automotive, I spent a week figuring out how to perform Bedini's Battery Switching using 100% solid state components (no relays, or even electronic relays, just MOSFETS). Lastly, on a completely different note, I have developed a line of potential products around the Rife technology. Using a Bedini Switching Circuit enables a battery powered device to last much longer between battery replacement/charges (which is why I decided I needed to make it work with solid state electronics).

    I have observed inventors (Stan Meyer, Ed Gray, Paul Pantone, Dennis Lee, and others) "disclose the secrets" of their technologies, all the while holding back that one critical element that really makes the magic happen. I have been instructed in the past to "teach them enough to be functional, but not enough to be dangerous". At 52 years of age, maybe it's a mid-life crisis thing, but suddenly I have questions I never asked before.

  5. #5
    Those are all very good and healthy questions. No, you are not going through a mid-life “crisis” that is detrimental. It's more as you grow older your life experience has caused you to go from a personal view to a more of a world view. Better get used to it as you will continue to ask those questions of yourself for the next 15 years. Instead of thinking crisis, think of it more as a plant stating to bloom.

    Commercialization can be a tough road. It's product development to fit an application, industrial production, legal issues, and marketing. Any of those steps can lead to a failure or if you navigate them successfully a satisfying monetary return.

    Your ideas are your own to do with as you please, so I can only ask questions to your questions. What are your motivations? Are you seeking wealth, a living with enough financial resources to continue your research, a better world, or to just get your ideas out there and accepted? There are no right or wrong answers to those questions, just shades of gray.

    Some things to consider. How much faith do you put in the patent process? As you can only legally patent an original idea, sometimes it is more important to be the first to publish. It is getting more common to protect an idea legally with a copyright instead of the traditional patent. What scale are you desiring to go after? What kind of income are you willing to pursue? Are you looking at only hard product, or books, speaking engagements, consultation, or a mix of those. What are your resources financial, time, health, and link-ups? What kind of a team can you put together? Engineers and manufacturing, machinists and labor, writers and editors?

    As you grow older your goals start changing, so it is good to ask those questions and keep asking.

    May God bless your journey,
    Michael

  6. #6
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpgmike View Post
    For one, I like to say, "I'd have to get 100 MPG for 100 years to get an ROI on what I spent learning how to get 100 MPG." I started out as a "car guy" who had to learn electronics, out of necessity, due to the massive reliance on electronics in modern automobiles. Over the last decade I transformed into an "electronics guy" that happens to have a fondness for cars.

    As for what I've learned over the past 2+ decades (not quite 30 years yet), much about the history of fuel economy, the players, their methods, their stories, and the politics. I experimented with fuel vapor systems. I got heavily involved with Paul Pantone in the late 90's, and was President of GEET for less than a year (1999). Later I was involved with Dennis Lee's HAFC HHO program. Since then I have spent much effort on refining HHO production, regulation, and quality enhancement. I explored PDI ignition; yet I run a mostly stock ignition on my vehicle (can't keep spark plugs in it otherwise). Some of my biggest bragging rights come in the form of electronic controls. Aside from automotive, I spent a week figuring out how to perform Bedini's Battery Switching using 100% solid state components (no relays, or even electronic relays, just MOSFETS). Lastly, on a completely different note, I have developed a line of potential products around the Rife technology. Using a Bedini Switching Circuit enables a battery powered device to last much longer between battery replacement/charges (which is why I decided I needed to make it work with solid state electronics).

    I have observed inventors (Stan Meyer, Ed Gray, Paul Pantone, Dennis Lee, and others) "disclose the secrets" of their technologies, all the while holding back that one critical element that really makes the magic happen. I have been instructed in the past to "teach them enough to be functional, but not enough to be dangerous". At 52 years of age, maybe it's a mid-life crisis thing, but suddenly I have questions I never asked before.
    Hi,
    I fully agree with you Mike, the present example is that of Ismael Aviso. he has had several version of the Technology that combine all of the Stan Meyer/EV Gray, perhaps Tom bearden's MEG as well.
    Strangely he is keeping a low profile (or asked to be so) even after National TV news broadcast the news of his developments and even funds granted by Pilipino government.
    Daniel dingle was another guy from the same place who faced imprisonment as a way to suppress him.
    this guy also really had that one essence which was a piece of the puzzle that was never disclosed.
    then there are those who are silently filing patents and re-grouping the embodiments and calling it their own.
    None the less we all have to move on if we are to bring these technologies into commercial or wide spread applications.
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.
    ‘Mass is the Spatial density of Matter (Particle) and the Temporal Intensity of Space (Field)’.

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