Bedini RPX Sideband Generator

* NEW * BEDINI RPX BOOK & DVD SET: BEDINI RPX


2019 ESTC ALL SEATS SOLD OUT!
PRE-REGISTER FOR THE
2020 ENERGY CONFERENCE

Monero XMR

Page 20 of 21 FirstFirst ... 1018192021 LastLast
Results 191 to 200 of 206

Thread: Complete Bedini SG Book!

  1. #191
    Hello guys!

    Can anyone pls tell me are these iron rods appropriate?
    http://www.amazon.com/Weldcote-Metal.../dp/B005BCUEYE

    Also I need confirmation that this is the right magnet wire that should be used:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/141097844655...84.m1497.l2649
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/370925618323...84.m1497.l2649
    Precisely I am talking about the enameling of the wires, it seems that the wires referred in the book are strongly enameled, or I am wrong? I already bought it, but need to be sure that I am not gonna make mistake considering that I have no much experience in these things..

    Thanks a lot!
    Ted

  2. #192
    Senior Member John_Koorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,077
    Hi Ted, you'll be fine with all of those.

    John K.

  3. #193

    Lightbulb

    Hi Ted, dont forget to wound the coil counter clockwise, if you do it another way you wont get best results.

  4. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by BEDINSSGUKRAINE View Post
    It would be great if in the next edition of the book would be presented an actual battery charging and discharging table, with times and loads.
    I definitely agree this would be the kind of indications that would make the SG be more of an industrial thing so to speak.

  5. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by tedhile View Post
    Hello guys!

    Can anyone pls tell me are these iron rods appropriate?
    http://www.amazon.com/Weldcote-Metal.../dp/B005BCUEYE

    Also I need confirmation that this is the right magnet wire that should be used:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/141097844655...84.m1497.l2649
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/370925618323...84.m1497.l2649
    Precisely I am talking about the enameling of the wires, it seems that the wires referred in the book are strongly enameled, or I am wrong? I already bought it, but need to be sure that I am not gonna make mistake considering that I have no much experience in these things..

    Thanks a lot!
    Ted
    Yes, those rods are fine from what Ive learned...

    I dont know what country you are in.. But I have found the best deal HERE for wire... Its actually cheaper to buy several small rolls rather than 1 very long roll... weird, but it tends to work out better for me anyways...
    “Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.”

  6. #196
    Hi All,

    I’ve built the Bedini SG according to the first manual and started on the second manual, awaiting to implement a speed sensor/tachometer so I can really fine tune it accurately (so matched transistors/resistor and pot-meter are already built in).

    Now I have a couple of theoretical questions regarding the understanding of the machine, which I hope some of you can help me with.

    1- When John talks about “firing” of the coil in his DVDs, he’s talking about the spike of the H-shape correct?
    2- John mentions in his DVDs that the firing takes place AFTER a magnet passes the coil. Am I correct in saying that this statement only applies if the SG machine is running in REPULSION mode?
    Since my SG machine is running in ATTRACTION mode, the firing takes place when the magnet is more or less right above the coil. Correct? (see Attachment 1)
    3- Looking at the H-shape, measured with my scope (Picoscope 2206B) over just 1 coil, can someone please explain to me exactly what goes on at the positions indicated in attachment 2, image 2:
    3a-I assume section A and D represent the nominal secundary battery voltage level (indicated also by the vertical line E?
    3b-What is happening exactly at section B and C? (in Energy from the vacuum DVD 6 @ 57min John mentions that in this section B the “device” is trying to be a “negistor”, but with that explanation it still is clear as mud to me .

    For those who reply/answer; please talk in lay person terms. I have a mechanical background, but for the electrical stuff I really am learning as I’m building. At the same time trying to catch up on theory via the book of Forest Mims and the Energy from the vacuum DVDs.

    Many thanks in advance!
    Rodolphe

    2019-02-27 - Attachment 1.jpg
    2019-02-27 - Attachment 2.jpg

  7. #197
    Hi Radolphe,

    #1 ...... The coil "fires" or "discharges" a high voltage "radiant" spike when the transistor abruptly turns off. This high voltage spike is collected by the high voltage diode and sent to the charge battery. So yes, this is the spike of the H-shape.

    #2 ....... Yes, in the video John shows a repulsion mode machine firing after the magnet passes the coil. When running in attraction made, the firing occurs as the magnet is approaching the coil. It may fire multiple times until the edge of the magnet reaches the edge of the coil core.

    #3 ....... 3a ............Section A, section D and line E are the nominal primary battery voltage. The transistor and coil scope shots only show what is happening in the primary circuit.

    3b ............ Section B is the period of time the transistor is "turned on" or conducting and the current is building up in the coil. The transistor turns "off" abruptly at the end of section B and section C begins. At this point, the coil voltage "radiant" spike occurs and is picked off by the high voltage diode and fed to the secondary battery. Section C is the remaining coil collapse voltage plus generated voltage from the passing magnet and also some coil ringing from the abrupt discharge. Section D is the nominal primary (run) battery voltage plus some voltage generated by the passing magnet. The transistor is turned "on" again at the end of section D to start the cycle of events over again.

    A "negisor" is any device that exhibits negative resistance or decreasing voltage drop with increasing current flow. The MJL21194 transistor is one of a handful of transistors that exhibit this characteristic at certain points in their operating curve. Such devices usually are cold to the touch when running in this condition. This behavior is often associated with radiant energy, plasma discharges, and also occurs with tunnel diodes. The SSG will still work, however, even without the "negistor" effect.
    Gary Hammond,

  8. #198
    Dear Gary,

    First of all thanks for your swift and elaborate answers! In reply to those:

    #2 My (theorethical) understanding was that the firing only would take place once; right above the center of the magnet, because that is the point where the flux-density switches; at the center of the magnet the max flux-density is reached, and when the magnet moves beyond this center point the flux-density decreases, and so right at that switching point the transistor would switch off. Now with this theoretical understanding that I had (before reading your reply), I thought that the reason why I saw a double firing on my scope, was because I didn’t space the magnets accurately enough. But looking at my scope reading again, the double firing looks rather constant; seems to prove your explanation (see attachment 1). My next question then is;
    Why does it fires double, instead of a single time according to my theoretical understanding? Has this to do with the fact that the “classical” view of how the magnetic lines moves around the magnet is not completely correct? Is the actual magnetic field shaped in such a way that there are multiple points of max flux-density (two in this case, instead of one at the center)? Howard Johnson talks about this unsymmetrical magnetic field, does that relate to this?

    #3a I’m I right in saying, that the term “nominal primary battery voltage” is incorrect for this sections A and D (and line E). For the following reason; there is no voltage across the coil in these sections, since the primary battery circuit in these sections is not connected. (If it would be, I would expect to see this voltage when I put a volt-meter across 1 coil when the wheel is not spinning, but it read 0V).

    #3b Thinking about the power consumption of the primary battery; if I understand you correctly this takes only place at section B, where the transistor is on, correct?

    #4 Regarding your negistor explanation:
    #4a Reading your explanation I realize that I was mixing up two different things: the H-shape is a visualization what happens across 1 coil, not what is happening across the transistor. But now that we brought it up, reading your explanation:
    Theoretically speaking; you’re saying that if I would see a plot/graph of the voltage across the transistor I would see a voltage INCREASE at the section where the transistor is switched on? Would I be able to see this on my scope? Do you by any change have any operating curve of this transistor showing this effect?
    #4b You say that the transistor runs cold to the touch when this effect takes place. Although in my attraction mode I do not use heatsinks, it was recommended to use heatsinks on in the repulsion mode. Can you comment on this please? What I mean; regardless of repulsion or attraction mode, the effect (H-shape), would be the same.

    #5 John mentions that the spikes (H-shape) can get hundreds of voltage high. The fact that it lights up my neons when I disconnect the secondary battery proves that the voltage is at least over 110V. If I look at attachment 1 again, I see a peak of +/-4.8V, using a 10x probe, that brings it to +/-48V I guess. Even when I crank the sample rate of my scope (piccoscop 2206B) up to the max, I don’t see higher peaks. Is this because I would need a scope with an even higher sampling rate/resolution or is there another cause for it?

    thanks again,
    Rodolphe

    2019-03-02 - Attachment 1.jpg

  9. #199
    Networking Architect Aaron Murakami's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Spokane, Washington
    Posts
    1,398
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rodolphe,

    The most common cause of multiple firing under any circumstance is usually too high of base resistance. If you leave the wheel still and slowly turn up the resistance at the base of the transistor, it will start to self oscillate. I don't know if that is your issue, but you could put like a 100 ohm resistor in series with a 10 turn pot of a couple k ohms to play around with the resistance just as a learning tool. It will give you a good feel for the circuit and how it operates for that particular variable. Whatever your resistance is right now, drop it 5-10% incrementally and see what happens - again, not sure if that is the cause, but its worth knowing about.

    There is no right or wrong number of magnets so it's not ultra critical. It's sometimes counter-intuitive because the rotor can actually go faster with fewer magnets depending on spacing. On very small SG units, I always had the fastest speeds with 3 magnets vs 4 for example - giving the system time to breathe so to speak.

    Also, think about what is triggering the base to begin with in both attraction vs repulsion mode. You mention the sequential mechanics of repulsion mode switch when the magnet goes past half way on the core, voltage reverses in the coil and we then get the proper voltage polarity at the base to turn it on. Coil charges then pushes magnet away. What do you think triggers the circuit in attraction mode?

    This isn't addressing all of your post - not answering for Gary, just a few things I wanted to mention that is food for thought.
    Aaron Murakami





    You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete.” ― Richard Buckminster Fuller

  10. #200
    Hi Rodolphe,

    Just got back from vacation and was on the road a couple of days, so just now getting back to you.

    #2 My (theorethical) understanding was that the firing only would take place once; right above the center of the magnet, because that is the point where the flux-density switches; at the center of the magnet the max flux-density is reached, and when the magnet moves beyond this center point the flux-density decreases, and so right at that switching point the transistor would switch off.
    This isn't quite right. It's my understanding that the field strength is highest at the edges of the magnet. Anyway, I double checked my SSG this morning with an automotive timing light. It was firing when the edge of the magnet was about 1/4" from the edge of the coil core. As the RPM picked up it was firing at about 1/8" away from the edge of the core. And I had a sniffer coil next to the secondary battery lead attached to channel two of my o-scope. The pulse on channel two was exactly in time with the channel one high voltage spike at transistor turn off. The channel one probe was at the transistor collector output to the power coil and high voltage diode connection. The probe ground was attached to the transistor to primary battery connection. And the machine was double firing at 211 RPM as seen on the scope, even though the timing light was only flashing once each time a magnet approached the coil.

    Why does it fires double, instead of a single time according to my theoretical understanding? Has this to do with the fact that the “classical” view of how the magnetic lines moves around the magnet is not completely correct? Is the actual magnetic field shaped in such a way that there are multiple points of max flux-density (two in this case, instead of one at the center)? Howard Johnson talks about this unsymmetrical magnetic field, does that relate to this?
    I'm not exactly sure about the double firing, but it has to do with the interaction between the permanent magnets, the power windings and the trigger winding of the coil. The factors that affect this are coil to magnet spacing, magnet strength, speed of rotation, and base resistance.

    The magnetic field is unsymmetrical, being stronger at the edges than in the middle and in the form of a vortex. But I don't think that's what causes multiple pulsing of the SSG.

    #3a I’m I right in saying, that the term “nominal primary battery voltage” is incorrect for this sections A and D (and line E). For the following reason; there is no voltage across the coil in these sections, since the primary battery circuit in these sections is not connected. (If it would be, I would expect to see this voltage when I put a volt-meter across 1 coil when the wheel is not spinning, but it read 0V).
    When the scope probe is on the transistor collector and the probe ground lead is attached to the emitter, the scope shows the voltage across the transistor. When the transistor is on this value is the forward voltage drop of the transistor (0 to .6 volts). When the transistor is off and the machine is not running the scope will show the primary battery voltage. ........... When the machine is running and the transistor is off, the scope will show the h wave that appears across the transistor. (When the wheel is not spinning a volt meter across the coil will show 0 volts and the same meter across the transistor will show the full primary battery voltage.)

    #4a Reading your explanation I realize that I was mixing up two different things: the H-shape is a visualization what happens across 1 coil, not what is happening across the transistor. But now that we brought it up, reading your explanation:
    Theoretically speaking; you’re saying that if I would see a plot/graph of the voltage across the transistor I would see a voltage INCREASE at the section where the transistor is switched on? Would I be able to see this on my scope? Do you by any change have any operating curve of this transistor showing this effect?
    The only difference between the scope trace across the coil and the scope trace across the transistor is whether you hook the probe ground lead to the primary battery positive post or the primary battery negative post. The trace is the same except for the zero voltage point on the scope, which is the value of the primary battery voltage. (And a scope trace of the trigger winding voltage is very similar, except it is inverted.)

    #3b Thinking about the power consumption of the primary battery; if I understand you correctly this takes only place at section B, where the transistor is on, correct?
    Yes, that is correct. The transistor should be "on" only about 18% to 23% of the time. This percentage of "on" time is known as the duty cycle. And another anomaly of this machine is that some of the radiant energy also is spiked back to the run (primary) battery while it is running. This allows the primary battery to discharge more slowly than it would on a purely resistive load at the same average current draw.

    #4b You say that the transistor runs cold to the touch when this effect takes place. Although in my attraction mode I do not use heatsinks, it was recommended to use heatsinks on in the repulsion mode. Can you comment on this please? What I mean; regardless of repulsion or attraction mode, the effect (H-shape), would be the same.
    You shouldn't need heat sinks running in attraction mode. And, yes, the h shape is the same in either mode.

    #5 John mentions that the spikes (H-shape) can get hundreds of voltage high. The fact that it lights up my neons when I disconnect the secondary battery proves that the voltage is at least over 110V. If I look at attachment 1 again, I see a peak of +/-4.8V, using a 10x probe, that brings it to +/-48V I guess. Even when I crank the sample rate of my scope (piccoscop 2206B) up to the max, I don’t see higher peaks. Is this because I would need a scope with an even higher sampling rate/resolution or is there another cause for it?
    Don't run the machine with the charge battery disconnected as the high voltage spikes can kill or weaken your transistors even though the neons are there to protect them. The high voltage spikes will be from 300 to 450 volts and are clamped at 90 to 100 volts by the neons (which can fail). When the charge (secondary) battery is hooked up, it absorbs the high voltage spikes. But because of the resistance in the wiring, you may still see spikes on the scope trace in the 20 to 50 volt range.

    Try hooking your scope to different places on the machine to get a better understanding of what's taking place in the various parts of the circuit. And use both channels at different places to see the relationships, but use only one probe ground connection so you don't get a ground loop short circuit.
    Gary Hammond,

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •