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Thread: Kromrey Disclosure - Bedini SG - Beyond the Advanced Handbook by Peter Lindemann

  1. #311
    System works just fine, why it stopped I do not know. Happy everything is still OK. I removed the extra diode at the output, don't know if it needed. Time to get ready for second coil after charge battery gets to 15.2v.

    Richard D.

  2. #312
    I stumbled onto something because of the sound that the rotor was making, I had to loosen the collars I have on the shaft that helped keep rotor centered above coil. By making a little extra play, I could tell by the sound and the vibration that the rotor was running faster than before moving collars. The rpm's before was around 680 rpm and was increasing faster than that. I started adjusting the 1K pot to lower the input current a little at a time and noticed the speed slowly increasing. Seems like the max speed with present settings is a little over 800 rpm with 1 amp input. I let setup run overnight till now and still running, the rpm's were holding around 800 rpm's. I think that I have found the other "sweet spot" for low current at high rpm's. Adjusting the 1K pot further to reduce the input current a little at a time the rpm's were slowly going down. Seems 1 amp input is the right spot with present coil spacing around 1/4". I need a small scale to get in there to get an accurate measurement.

    Not easy to adjust coil distance because the slots in the frame are too small for the hardware that came with the coil forms. I had to widen the slot be hand so I could move the coil which is still a bit snug. To add more coils I have to do the same thing with the other 5 slots with a hand drill. Frame was not cut right for hardware supplied and should not have happened. I don't like having to use a hammer just to get the bolts through slot.

    Even though JK mentioned why the 1N4007 diodes were used, the same diodes were used in SG book #1 and no resistor in series with the neon bulb as the 8 transistor kit has a series resistor. Should it be there or not is the question? Now, should I add the second coil or wait to finish charging the charge battery to 14.5v+. Right now, the primary is at 12.25v and the charge battery is at 12.79v and I do not have my original test data from my first SSG bike wheel so I am not sure what is the minimum voltage for the primary battery before switching to another battery? I'm thinking about 12.0v? My old computer died where the information is and just received a Hard Drive reader to retrieve the lost files.

    I'm still re-reading the SG books for tuning and capacitor discharge as to Part 37 for capacitor discharge. I assume that adding the second coil will help with charging a battery before the cap discharge ckt. I am venturing into new territory that I've never been before and need to depend on info from the forum instead of what is on the internet. Any input from anyone is welcomed to complete what I started. I recall in the video that PL did on the 'mini-beast' that "it is not the start of a home generator at all" and I will prove him wrong. Remember what Einstein stated, "Imagination is more important than knowledge" and I have a vivid imagination, according to my grandparents that showed-up so called EE Engineers and PHD Engineers where I use to work at a defense contractor. I just need input...

    Thanks for the input...

    rdvideo

  3. #313
    Stop discharging regular charged battery's at 12V minimum......

    With SSG charged battery's, stop at 12.10V and as they condition more and more, stop at higher voltages so that you are operating in a higher range of voltages when a bank is standing at 13V+ after 1 hour, don't discharge it below 12.3V-12.4V and it will produce the same Ah of power +, as a standard charged battery....

  4. #314
    Thanks for the info RS! I still have some time before having to replace the primary since I am only using 1 amp of power! Primary battery is at 12.23v and charge battery at 12.82v. I think I need another coil? Rpm still hanging around 800.

    We'll see what tomorrow brings... Too late... Take care...

    Richard D.

  5. #315
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RS_ View Post
    Stop discharging regular charged battery's at 12V minimum......

    With SSG charged battery's, stop at 12.10V and as they condition more and more, stop at higher voltages so that you are operating in a higher range of voltages when a bank is standing at 13V+ after 1 hour, don't discharge it below 12.3V-12.4V and it will produce the same Ah of power +, as a standard charged battery....
    Hi RS,
    Are you saying SSG charged batteries if discharged below 12.4V will loose their ability to show the Radiant gain(COP) they attained over the SSG mode of Charging process?
    I have noticed that a SSG charged battery seems to exhibit more COP when left charged for long durations, quite contrary to the belief that the gain is lost over a 48 hours 'storage period' any expert opinion??
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.
    Last edited by Faraday88; 07-09-2018 at 04:10 AM. Reason: corrections
    ‘Mass is spatial density of Matter (Particle) and Temporal density of Space (Field)’.

  6. #316
    Something like that, if a highly cycled SSG charged battery is let stand for 1-4 hours after charging and have 13V + then don't discharge them so deep, and they will bounce back up much easier the next charge cycle. And still have a good output.

    So think about it, a normal charged battery will stand at 12.7V +/- and discharge down to 12 = x Ah

    I have seen highly cycled L16's stand at 13.10+, (in 24V Banks) and not discharge below 13V for 30 min or so, and take over 3 hours to go below 12.90V and the another 8 Hours or so to get down to the 12.4V I was stopping at, and still have the same Ah or more than a normal charged battery.

    It makes the battery operate in a different Voltage range, and different state of Sulfanation, closer to the non supfhanation range of the charged battery, than the highly Sulfanated state of a battery that has been discharged down to 12V -.

    Every discharge cycle of a normal charge battery creates a layer of sulfate on the plates, a charge cycle should get rid of ALL of that layer, but normal chargers cant do that and get them up over 15V+, where the spikes in the SSG works different and can get them up to 16V + if allowed to.....

    Some times it takes a Lot of cycles to brake through all the layers of Sulfanation that have built up, and is why new battery's are better to start with, as less sulfate layers to dissolve back into the electrolyte to get a fully charged battery......

    See PL's Battery Presentation from 2011 for more info on the Charge / Discharge state chemistry of the battery and the 2 different plate compounds / electrolyte, and how it changes when charged and discharged.....
    Last edited by RS_; 07-09-2018 at 07:33 PM.

  7. #317
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RS_ View Post
    Something like that, if a highly cycled SSG charged battery is let stand for 1-4 hours after charging and have 13V + then don't discharge them so deep, and they will bounce back up much easier the next charge cycle. And still have a good output.

    So think about it, a normal charged battery will stand at 12.7V +/- and discharge down to 12 = x Ah

    I have seen highly cycled L16's stand at 13.10+, (in 24V Banks) and not discharge below 13V for 30 min or so, and take over 3 hours to go below 12.90V and the another 8 Hours or so to get down to the 12.4V I was stopping at, and still have the same Ah or more than a normal charged battery.

    It makes the battery operate in a different Voltage range, and different state of Sulfanation, closer to the non supfhanation range of the charged battery, than the highly Sulfanated state of a battery that has been discharged down to 12V -.

    Every discharge cycle of a normal charge battery creates a layer of sulfate on the plates, a charge cycle should get rid of ALL of that layer, but normal chargers cant do that and get them up over 15V+, where the spikes in the SSG works different and can get them up to 16V + if allowed to.....

    Some times it takes a Lot of cycles to brake through all the layers of Sulfanation that have built up, and is why new battery's are better to start with, as less sulfate layers to dissolve back into the electrolyte to get a fully charged battery......

    See PL's Battery Presentation from 2011 for more info on the Charge / Discharge state chemistry of the battery and the 2 different plate compounds / electrolyte, and how it changes when charged and discharged.....
    Hi RS,
    Cheers for that little briefings! can we not express the battery in terms of its 'Q''-factor like how we do that for Inductor or Capacitor. this expression is a ratio of the Energy stored per cycle to that dissipated per cycles?. In our case here Charge -Discharge cycles.
    would the COP expression be same as this??
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.
    ‘Mass is spatial density of Matter (Particle) and Temporal density of Space (Field)’.

  8. #318
    Senior Member Yaro1776's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RS_ View Post
    Something like that, if a highly cycled SSG charged battery is let stand for 1-4 hours after charging and have 13V + then don't discharge them so deep, and they will bounce back up much easier the next charge cycle. And still have a good output.

    So think about it, a normal charged battery will stand at 12.7V +/- and discharge down to 12 = x Ah

    I have seen highly cycled L16's stand at 13.10+, (in 24V Banks) and not discharge below 13V for 30 min or so, and take over 3 hours to go below 12.90V and the another 8 Hours or so to get down to the 12.4V I was stopping at, and still have the same Ah or more than a normal charged battery.

    It makes the battery operate in a different Voltage range, and different state of Sulfanation, closer to the non supfhanation range of the charged battery, than the highly Sulfanated state of a battery that has been discharged down to 12V -.

    ..
    I agree with RS's statements with regard to the batteries altering their charge and discharge characteristics. After numerous cycles the battery appears to become addicted to the SSG's charging magic and the maximum charge voltage keeps rising up to 16 volts. Some experimenters are unaware of this fact and stop charging at 15.3v or so, thereby losing the extra kick and desulfation provided by the higher voltage threshold - net result is that the battery appears to lose Ah capacity. This leads to the erroneous assumption that this charging process is killing the battery!

    RS is also spot on with the discharge voltage threshold of 12.3-12.4 volts. Much of this depends on the battery type used...

    Bear in mind that these observations and results are based on hundreds of individual SSG tests that were performed by me several years ago. A number of batteries were toasted by this experimenter's ignorance.

    Yaro
    Yaro

    "The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you." -Neil Degrasse Tyson

  9. #319
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yaro1776 View Post
    I agree with RS's statements with regard to the batteries altering their charge and discharge characteristics. After numerous cycles the battery appears to become addicted to the SSG's charging magic and the maximum charge voltage keeps rising up to 16 volts. Some experimenters are unaware of this fact and stop charging at 15.3v or so, thereby losing the extra kick and desulfation provided by the higher voltage threshold - net result is that the battery appears to lose Ah capacity. This leads to the erroneous assumption that this charging process is killing the battery!

    RS is also spot on with the discharge voltage threshold of 12.3-12.4 volts. Much of this depends on the battery type used...

    Bear in mind that these observations and results are based on hundreds of individual SSG tests that were performed by me several years ago. A number of batteries were toasted by this experimenter's ignorance.

    Yaro
    Hi Yaro,
    Perfect !!! AGMs were refilled and SSG revived... unfortunately some of the cells were gone (shorted), so it revived only the good ones, Yes 16V plus..
    Rgds,
    BTW your signature is superb!
    Faraday88.
    ‘Mass is spatial density of Matter (Particle) and Temporal density of Space (Field)’.

  10. #320
    I'm back,

    One thing I want to make note of is why my system stopped before all by itself is because of the cheap analog ammeter that I was using.Attachment 6982.

    Good thing that I bought 2 of them and to find better ammeters for future experiments.

    I just finished charging my first deep cycle battery to 15.2v last night late and then let it rest. 20hrs later it sits at 13.40v which I recall when doing experiments with bike wheel and 7AH batteries back in 2013. And yes, I have charged the batteries then to 16v+ because I was delayed at stopping the charge and they still worked fine with more cycles. I did not know about stopping at approximately 12.4v discharging then as I do now with the 105AH batteries I am using now. Took about two days to get where I am now with only one coil but the system happily cruzed at 820 rpm's. Now to do the C20 discharge rate while I finish building the second half of the 8 transistor kit and add the second genny coil to my system. This should show a faster charge rate I hope and will see when I go to charge battery again this weekend while I can watch what is going on. Yes, automate everything.

    Thanks RS and other members for your help and just keep it coming.

    I will not start another run until I finish building the second half of 8 transistor ckt and take it from there.

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