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Thread: Cap Dump

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by BroMikey View Post
    Thanks Chris

    It sounds right to me also, yet when I use the calculators for capacitor joules I find something different.
    It sounds like a pulse of 31vdc X 2.25 amps every second would come out to 69watt/seconds.

    This is in regard to John Bedini's LAB MACHINE youtube video.


    Mike

    Hi Mike,
    you're talking about this vid right:


    At about 6:20 John talks about the joules...
    the way I understand it is that the cap reaches 31 volts and then dumps into a 13 volt battery. So that's 18 volts x 2.25 amps per second according to his amp meter. Still very nice charging.

  2. #22
    Ah yes, I also forgot to account for the actual voltage drop vs the total voltage in the cap.

    So JB is dumping 18 volts to a 12 v battery huh... Hmmmm.

    Quote Originally Posted by min2oly View Post
    Hi Mike,
    you're talking about this vid right:


    At about 6:20 John talks about the joules...
    the way I understand it is that the cap reaches 31 volts and then dumps into a 13 volt battery. So that's 18 volts x 2.25 amps per second according to his amp meter. Still very nice charging.

  3. #23
    I've had good success using a heavy duty SCR and one zener diode. The sch is below. All I do to adjust the voltage is swap out the zener for a different value. Right now I have a 16V zener on there. So 16V + about 2V that the SCR requires and that's roughly 18 volts over the battery voltage. I felt that this was better than using a 12 V zener because I wanted the battery to always have at a minimum of double the voltage hitting it. When the battery gets up to 15.5V, that's more than the 12V zener would produce on this circuit. I've never blown out one of either of the SCR's shown below either.

    Schematic:
    SCR-Zener-CapDump.jpg

    A couple different SCR's I've used. The larger one is a 2N1913 and the smaller one says R16RIA60 on it. Found these at my local surplus store. Skycraft Parts & Surplus, Inc.
    2013-03-28_20-30-20_886.jpg


    -Chris

  4. #24
    A question to the experts:
    How can I stop the SCR after it dumped the cap?
    From the SCR properties it doesn't stop until the main connection is disconnected.

    Ralf

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by romeo-kilo View Post
    A question to the experts:
    How can I stop the SCR after it dumped the cap?
    From the SCR properties it doesn't stop until the main connection is disconnected.

    Ralf
    The SCR is designed to stop when the current stops, then it resets. As long as the current flows (ie... Cap voltage does not equal Battery voltage), it will not reset. If you keep pulsing the cap during the discharge cycle, you may never get it to stop without a disconnect. What is happening - as the cap discharges the current flow slows because the internal resistance of the battery - cap voltage = 12.5v and the battery is 12v - that .5v difference takes more time to discharge than the next incoming pulse. That next pulse slightly charges the cap and then you will get to a point where it will find a happy medium where you can never get it to equalize allowing the SCR to reset because you can't get the cap to fully discharge. If you are running into this problem, then that means your pulse design is very good, but you may have to go with another style dump circuit. I use op-amps to control the start/stop of dump with feedback to turn off pulses during discharge.

    You might want to try decreasing the size of the charge cap. That will increase the frequency of the dump, but should decrease the amount of time needed to complete the discharge. The ideal frequency should be around 1 hertz, but a 3 or 4 hertz should still do the job.
    Last edited by Diverfun; 04-02-2014 at 01:32 AM.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    It is called Resonant Commutation...Specially when a Pulse -Discharge Capacitor application is at work the device is under what is called as Under damped Oscillatory Discharge where in the a LC resonant tank circuit formed by the Discharging Capacitor along with the 'load' (the battery here) and the device (SCR), A Reverse current which will force the device below its Holding current will shut it off, hence only a Trigger to turn ON the device is needed while the device undergoes self turn OFF..!
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Faraday88 View Post
    It is called Resonant Commutation...Specially when a Pulse -Discharge Capacitor application is at work the device is under what is called as Under damped Oscillatory Discharge where in the a LC resonant tank circuit formed by the Discharging Capacitor along with the 'load' (the battery here) and the device (SCR), A Reverse current which will force the device below its Holding current will shut it off, hence only a Trigger to turn ON the device is needed while the device undergoes self turn OFF..!
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.
    Ralf
    What he is suggesting is to induce some Reverse Current (or noise) into the circuit. You could do this by wrapping a wire around your bi-filer coil and connect the ends between the SCR and Negative side of the Charge Cap. The pulses from the coil should reset the SCR. How many turns and which end connects to the SCR will take some experimenting. Doing this will cause the SCR to reset at a unknown point (ie... 15v at cap instead of 12.5v), but removing or adding some turns will change the reset point. The reason for between the Charge Cap and SCR is to keep the noise from affecting the circuit when the cap is charging. (Hopefully not to cause the SCR to trigger on too soon.)
    Last edited by Diverfun; 04-03-2014 at 04:28 PM.

  8. #28
    Nice!
    another thing I've done is to add an inductor in series w/ the Zener and LED that trigger the SCR. If you use a tunable inductor (air coil w/ movable rod in the core) This will help to adjust timing.
    Nice thread here - Kind Regards,
    Patrick

    Quote Originally Posted by Diverfun View Post
    Ralf
    What he is suggesting is to induce some Reverse Current (or noise) into the circuit. You could do this by wrapping a wire around your bi-filer coil and connect the ends between the SCR and Negative side of the Charge Cap. The pulses from the coil should reset the SCR. How many turns and which end connects to the SCR will take some experimenting. Doing this will cause the SCR to reset at a unknown point (ie... 15v at cap instead of 12.5v), but removing or adding some turns will change the reset point. The reason for between the Charge Cap and SCR is to keep the noise from affecting the circuit when the cap is charging. (Hopefully not to cause the SCR to trigger on too soon.)

  9. #29
    How could be replaced the neon bulb in sg circuit with another equivalent part ?

  10. #30
    Senior Member Faraday88's Avatar
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    You can use a High-Voltage Fast Recovery Diode say...BYV26E in reverse Polarization between Collector and the emitter to get the same function as the of course with no Glow!!!
    Rgds,
    Faraday88.

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