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  • #61
    I appreciate what you've been sharing with us even if I don't comment very often! In fact, I appreciate most of what is shared on this forum and try to keep up with all the new posts every day.

    I removed the triger wire on my old rotored SSG as well and replaced it with two hall switches in series switching two small transistors to trigger a 5 filar, #18 AWG x155' power coil. This allowed me to adjust both the timing and pulse width. The net result was a decrease in radiant mode charging but an increase in generator mode charging compared to using the trigger coil. It went over a cop of 1 in charge mode.

    Anyway, keep up the good work. I'm sure I'm not the only one following your contributions with great interest.

    P.S. I may have to try FET's to replace the two small transistors for cleaner, faster switching of the 21194's.
    Thanks Gary, I almost forgot to respond, hard to keep up sometimes. That sounds interesting too. I tell you what if you can adapt some fets to it I would give it a try. Fets require practically no current which is a huge benefit when we are paying for the trigger. They can be finicky but if you use a pull down resistor you can get pretty fast switching,, Those ones I am using also trigger nicely on just a 5v logic signal, they can handle much more but they respond nicely to just my micro controller.

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    • #62
      BOB
      A Clean off is name of the game and a full on is to i like to see a diagram and specs etc be for i say much more .i do understand what
      your doing and how . anytime you get better control of the trigger you have you finger on the hart of system .because once its on its out
      of you control for what you set up [batt volts coil spec.] draw up a diagram so i can see and say more
      guy

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      • #63
        I have an improvement to the system to share with the group.

        If you recall I mentioned that I wanted to utilize those old trigger windings for induction. I have configured a bridge and a regulator on one of them to feed the FET board supply and the micro controller. This means that I no longer need an external supply for the switching ( no more 6v battery).

        So yes I am using the trigger wire after all ;-) ,,, but not in the way it was ever intended. It is being excited by the power coils and I am rectifying that to a cap. The cap then supplies both the micro controller and the supply that is being switched on the FET’s to tickle the BJT’s.

        Here is a picture

        MCTrigger2.jpg

        Here is a video of it in action.

        https://files.secureserver.net/0sq0finI9klsQM

        Comment


        • #64
          nice way to us the trigger as a genny coil...... this can also be done by splitting the number of coils.. if you have an 8 strand you can run 4 as power 4 as genny windings.

          another thing that can be done with a genny coil is on a rotored SG to double the length of your core. then you hang a genny coil off the rod extending out the back. this keeps the genny coil coupled only to the flux change in the core, and not loading down the rotor any.

          Good work Bob!!

          Tom C


          experimental Kits, chargers and solar trackers

          Comment


          • #65
            Hi Bob,

            That's pretty sweet! I'll be interested to see what kind of COP's you get with these coils.

            Comment


            • #66
              Thanks guys. I am pretty happy so far with this setup.

              Gary I am still finding the best timing configurations to run on before I do any real measuring, slight adjustments can have major consequences. For example I have already changed my OFF/ON ratio a bit because I think I needed a little higher frequency for the induction. Currently running at 5800 off and 2200 on. The idea was a little less punch but at a faster rate, to increase the cap production. That induction situation has special considerations since it is the trigger supply via a feedback loop or whatever you might call it. Anyway Blahh, Blahh ,,, what I am trying to say is it still needs some tweaking. I tend to share these ideas before they are completely polished. I would like to run it from solar eventually so although I always shoot for best efficiency it will not matter all too much as long as I can keep it going between clouds.

              Tom I know what your saying about the double stack coil. I first saw that on some of the old 3pm kit video's.

              Comment


              • #67
                Hey Bob, do you think you can get it to charge a second battery also?

                Comment


                • #68
                  Hi John,

                  Yes I could put many more on the back end because this is a pure radiant output. If it were a cap dumping system I would be limited because of the current distribution but this system cares little about current on the output, it works by voltage potential.

                  In a situation where you add more to the back you may have to increase your input slightly, it does matter a little but it is not a doubling type of relationship. What i mean is if it takes 1 and a half amps to do one, it does not mean it takes 3 amps to do two. I have found generally speaking that on a 8 transistor setup you might need to increase your draw 100ma or so for additional batteries. It also depends on if you use series or parallel.

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                  • #69
                    A new toy for the mix...

                    So I just finished a run on one of my walmart batteries and I have put a new meter in play. This meter goes in-line between the source and the load and computes watt hours and Amp hours for us. Anyone who has ever been serious about taking precise measurements will know that because of the Primary voltage falling and the secondary rising it is very difficult to get a precise understanding of what has been spent and what has been stored on a run.

                    For example you may start your run at 1amp draw but guess what, a half an hour into it you are no longer at exactly 1 amp, you may be at .999 amp, and then a few hours later .955 and so on. The primary is a constantly moving target and it is really hard to make accurate readings of what is actually going on. This new meter may not be perfect but it will at least keep track of the math and computations for us. It can tell us in watt hours what was used regardless of the voltage drop.

                    So with that said what I have done is taken pictures of the meter at the end of the run showing both watt hours and amp hours and then I cropped and pasted those into the top of the chart. So now my charts will show not only the shape of the run but also the actual readings in power.

                    We will eventually put this to good use by metering a load from the charge battery using the same meter so for example we could put 20 watt hours in and take 20 watt hours out for comparison.

                    I shot some video while this run was happening but it came out to be a large file. I realized that if I set my phone on lower resolution settings It will be less painful to download these video's so I am not posting that last one. I will start shooting at lower res and hopefully it will be a better experience to watch them.

                    This run was started at 500ma draw but I changed it early on to 1.5A. I am going to charge up my other walmart battery and then we can play around with taking some loads with the new meter.

                    XWalmartB1R1Charge.jpg

                    WalmartB1R1Primary.jpg

                    *EDIT*
                    I may not have made it clear but the new meter is inline between the primary and the SS so perhaps I should have pasted the shots on the primary chart. As long as you understand what is being shown is the power that was consumed from the primary to charge the secondary.
                    Last edited by BobZilla; 06-21-2014, 11:41 AM.

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                    • #70
                      I'm having second thoughts about the new meter. It seems to be affecting my circuit, at first I thought it was the power drain so I gave it an external supply. The external supply ensured that it was not stealing from the primary but I think the problem runs deeper than that.

                      What I think is going on is that because the device is always on it does not allow a proper "bounce" on the primary. What I mean is we need periods of complete rest,, zero current and putting this little meter on there is like a constant attenuator even if it is very very little. The same goes for the multi meters I use to chart with. Things do still charge of course but I cannot stress enough that when working with this technology you must have brief OFF periods where no current flows at all, not even a little tiny bit.

                      i have always noticed that I got better results when I did not meter my runs, it is hard to realize it without the chart to prove it but intuitively you notice that a run took less time or that your primary is fuller at the end. I think now I know why, it is not that the meter is using much power but rather it does not allow a proper relaxation period. We are playing with resonance and you will dull down the ringing if you have a constant tension on it basically.

                      I will need to do some comparison runs both with and without any meters and see if what I am thinking pans out but it makes sense to me. Again it is not that the meters consume much, it is that they keep a constant tension in one direction even if it is very little.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Hi Bob,
                        what if you put a nice size cap between the meter and the energizer?
                        so primary --- meter --- cap --- energizer...
                        This is how I take my meter readings. I do shunt the meter after I have the reading, then at set times during the run, I remove the shunt take a reading and so on. Maybe your arduino could control a relay to remove the shunt at set times so you could have a good set of readings...

                        I also get better charging w/o the meters.
                        KR - Patrick



                        Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
                        I'm having second thoughts about the new meter. It seems to be affecting my circuit, at first I thought it was the power drain so I gave it an external supply. The external supply ensured that it was not stealing from the primary but I think the problem runs deeper than that.

                        What I think is going on is that because the device is always on it does not allow a proper "bounce" on the primary. What I mean is we need periods of complete rest,, zero current and putting this little meter on there is like a constant attenuator even if it is very very little. The same goes for the multi meters I use to chart with. Things do still charge of course but I cannot stress enough that when working with this technology you must have brief OFF periods where no current flows at all, not even a little tiny bit.

                        i have always noticed that I got better results when I did not meter my runs, it is hard to realize it without the chart to prove it but intuitively you notice that a run took less time or that your primary is fuller at the end. I think now I know why, it is not that the meter is using much power but rather it does not allow a proper relaxation period. We are playing with resonance and you will dull down the ringing if you have a constant tension on it basically.

                        I will need to do some comparison runs both with and without any meters and see if what I am thinking pans out but it makes sense to me. Again it is not that the meters consume much, it is that they keep a constant tension in one direction even if it is very little.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          UPDATE:
                          It's been awhile since I posted about this board. I mounted an old wheel from a a past project and am running it as a two coiler, all the same coils and board but running it as a wheel.

                          I took the micro controller off and put the original pot/bulb back on to run it on the wheel.

                          Here is a pic. I still need to improve the frame. It shakes a lot and I need to put some braces across the two boards to sure it up. I also ordered some new bearings for the hub but they have not arrived yet.

                          PIC:
                          sm2coiler.jpg

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                          • #73
                            I got my bearings and sured up the frame a little but my bearings are still not good. I have ordered some different ones and hope to get this machine smoothed out a bit more. It is usable as it is now but I am not happy with it.

                            So I ran an experiment in Gen mode and I wanted to share with the group. What I did was use my power meters and I pulled 20 watt hours as a load, then ran the machine to recharge using 20 watt hours. I did this twice and the results are pretty good. Each time it appears that the energy was replenished.

                            Again what this represents is a 20 watt hour load, then a 20 watt hour run, twice.

                            20wh_Run.jpg

                            As usual I shot some video of the run in progress...

                            LINK:
                            https://files.secureserver.net/0sm4dv0scfFkiM

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              I got the second new bearings which are 7/16 and have the cage with no internal play. These were rated for electric motor usage, now this thing is running like it should.

                              Another video:
                              https://files.secureserver.net/0smqHuewROU8kO

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Nice work!
                                I like the Red on LED and the Blue discharge, very cool.
                                You make me wish I had a super pole configuration that I could run side by side w/ the one have have on the bench for some experiments.
                                That's a crazy looking curve you have there. Looks like 1:1.5?
                                Cool
                                Patrick A.

                                Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
                                I got my bearings and sured up the frame a little but my bearings are still not good. I have ordered some different ones and hope to get this machine smoothed out a bit more. It is usable as it is now but I am not happy with it.

                                So I ran an experiment in Gen mode and I wanted to share with the group. What I did was use my power meters and I pulled 20 watt hours as a load, then ran the machine to recharge using 20 watt hours. I did this twice and the results are pretty good. Each time it appears that the energy was replenished.

                                Again what this represents is a 20 watt hour load, then a 20 watt hour run, twice.

                                [ATTACH=CONFIG]3596[/ATTACH]

                                As usual I shot some video of the run in progress...

                                LINK:
                                https://files.secureserver.net/0sm4dv0scfFkiM

                                Comment

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