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8 transistor Board

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  • #16
    Good stuff guys.

    Patrick I may have to pick your brain a little down the road. I would like to do what you are already doing with my setup. For now I am just going to keep running this new board through different settings and whatnot but I really want to run some solid state from solar. To me it seems like a great idea. I tried it with a wheel before but found that when the sun hides the wheel stops. Perhaps if I had of put a large cap on the front like you have done I could have fixed that but it doesn't matter now, I want to do it with SS.

    Question about all the lights you ran in your home. What kind of wiring did you use and do you think you get much loss? Originally I was thinking I would charge a bank and use an inverter because of the ability to run distances with AC but it sounds as if you use straight up DC in your application. Did you distribute all from the garage or do you move batteries around to hook-up points throughout? Honestly I have never distributed DC for more than a few feet so I am curious about the pitfalls if any.

    Also are these the type you use or similar? I just ordered a few of these to see how they perform.

    LINK:
    http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a...m-white/1.html

    BTW guys the first run is getting there, geez I just want to crank it up a bit lol. I will be lucky if I get the job done with a single primary, right now the charge is at 13.4 and primary is 11.28,,, cmon curve!


    Oh and branch maybe if I hook up my junk to the solar we will see those flames your talking about ;-)

    Comment


    • #17
      Hi Patrick,
      Since this thread is about SS I won't feel too bad asking about your setup. Most of my boards are "boring" 'ol 8 x 130ft, 22awg with 250uf cpd mods. It's hard for me to compare with everyone else because that's all I have been doing. Now on the other hand your coil seems to be coming from a far far away galaxy: I counted more wires/coils then there are transistors and you have 2 yellow 250uf but only one is connected? Care to shade some light on your marathonian runner?
      Thanks
      NoFear.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
        Question about all the lights you ran in your home. What kind of wiring did you use and do you think you get much loss? Originally I was thinking I would charge a bank and use an inverter because of the ability to run distances with AC but it sounds as if you use straight up DC in your application. Did you distribute all from the garage or do you move batteries around to hook-up points throughout? Honestly I have never distributed DC for more than a few feet so I am curious about the pitfalls if any.
        DC direct to batteries w/ fuses. I used underground yard wires, the longest run is about 65' still lights nicely, at this low amp draw I honestly do not see the difference in light compared to one I stuck right on the battery. I don't care too much about the losses as long as the batteries charge compensates. the loss will be in warmth anyway :-)

        Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
        Also are these the type you use or similar? I just ordered a few of these to see how they perform.

        LINK:
        http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a...m-white/1.html
        I have a couple of these, and some that are just bright white regular led's from china direct/via ebay - I think they have 25-50leds in the fixture. They draw a bit less, can't find them on ebay right now... I had pictures posted on the old yahoo. I'll have to take some later to post. I have a few smd's (don't like the "warm white" - really yellow)



        Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
        Oh and branch maybe if I hook up my junk to the solar we will see those flames your talking about ;-)
        Rofl...
        KR,
        Patrick

        Comment


        • #19
          Hi Nofear,
          That coil has gone through various arrangements. I have it wired up as a 4 filer, the trigger wire is 1/2 the length of the 3 power winds. Yes only one cap is being used, this one also has the diode to the branch of the base resistors. those transistors were directly off the 3PM kit, I literally ripped them off the kit and soldered them to this build. I have no idea if they are matched, that goes for diodes and resistors.
          It's not my most efficient SS but it does the best job on that bank.
          KR,
          Patrick


          Originally posted by Nofear View Post
          Hi Patrick,
          Since this thread is about SS I won't feel too bad asking about your setup. Most of my boards are "boring" 'ol 8 x 130ft, 22awg with 250uf cpd mods. It's hard for me to compare with everyone else because that's all I have been doing. Now on the other hand your coil seems to be coming from a far far away galaxy: I counted more wires/coils then there are transistors and you have 2 yellow 250uf but only one is connected? Care to shade some light on your marathonian runner?
          Thanks
          NoFear.
          Last edited by min2oly; 05-27-2014, 11:17 AM. Reason: forgot to sign...

          Comment


          • #20
            Hi,

            i'm just fascinated. Thanks to all for the info, also Tom for answering my questions on the parts and kit via email these pas few days.

            Patrick: is the 3 filar the one you show in one of your videos?

            here's my challenge: Does Bedini or anyone spec out how to design a system?
            Let's say you have to charge 1000Ah every day and you use them up overnight.
            What is the best coil (#wires, lenght, turns, core) and transistor combination to
            do that?

            Along the same line: is a 3-filar 300' 3 transitors system equivalent or better or worse
            than a 6-filar 150' 6 transistor system?

            This is my biggest source of frustration. I've used fans and build some small coils. they
            all work. The bigger the coil and the more transistors, the faster the charge... duh!

            Anyone can help with design? thanks

            Comment


            • #21
              Hey Patrick,

              I have a similar setup to yours. It's a 4 x #18 4T connected to a 24v 200W panel (which only puts out a max of about 100w). I am using a 34,000uF 50v cap bank as the primary. Currently I'm using it rejuvenate a 130Ah 12v battery.

              The difference is I'm not using the cap diode mod, so I see the voltage on the cap bank swing from a few volts in low light to about 42v in full sun. I'm interested in how you are using the mod to regulate the cap voltage. Would you mind scratching out a schematic on that part of the circuit for me? Apologies if you already posted it and I missed it.

              Just to add, I find with my setup if I tune the base resistance for high input voltage and lower current it will charge better in both low light and full sun. For example, if I tune for 40v at 1A it charges better than if I tune for 20v at 2A.

              John K.

              Comment


              • #22
                Nice build Bob,

                I just went through your video for the second time.

                i have one question specifically about that setup. Why did you choose
                to go with two coils of 4 (power) wires and not one coil of 8 (power) wires?

                and then for your build specifically. do both coils have a trigger? unless I missed
                it you show the trigger going into the left side only. So are both coils triggered by
                the trigger coil of one or are both trigger coil used for their respective 4 transistors.

                THanks

                YVes

                PS: sorry, it's late here and I can't seem to ask questions in simple terms...

                Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
                Greetings friends,

                I built a new board that I want to share with the group. I have it configured as a solid state charger at the moment but it may get converted to mechanical at a later time.

                This board is using 10A diodes on the collector, 200Ohm wire wound 1 percent resistors on the base. The coils are from Teslagenx 130ft 18Awg 4 strand (two of them) and a 2k Ohm pot.

                To start out this post I am going to do some "normal" runs with charts so we can observe it in mode 1 at various inputs and later on I will start adding in my tricks like Gen mode and cap dumping. We will just start out with basic runs though.

                Here are some shots of the board:

                [ATTACH=CONFIG]3463[/ATTACH]

                [ATTACH=CONFIG]3464[/ATTACH]


                Here is an introduction video where I describe the device and run it though some various settings. I also have a meter hooked up to look at frequency across the power coil. It is a little long but if your into this sort of thing you may enjoy it.

                VIDEO:
                https://files.secureserver.net/0sPrwGz3JOvDJ2

                Feel free to chime in with questions or comments. I post this stuff in the interest of the group, not to just talk to myself ;-)

                Comment


                • #23
                  Hi YVes,

                  Those are good questions. The main reason I used the two coils instead of one is simply because I already had them. They came off of a two coil wheel I had running that I upgraded to a single coil. Now because of them I do plan to try some unusual stuff though. Notice they are pointing in at each other ( top to top)? That was not by chance. That part of the experiment will come later but it is secondary, because I have two I can play with them but the real answer is just because I had two.

                  For the triggers I am only using the one on the left at the moment. The coil on the right is only slaved in. If you look closely you will see the last two wires (far right) are not connected to anything, that is the other trigger wire. I have thought about putting a bridge on that one and maybe filling a cap, or I could put it in series/parallel with the other trigger for different effects on the circuit but for now it is not doing anything.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Hi John,
                    here it is click me
                    Re solar you need to balance the primary cap w/ the oscillator cap. once in place you will hear it shift gears all day long depending on what's allowed through to the panel. you must have two of those 24v in series to get 40v to the primary cap?
                    I've never ran this mod higher than 18volts...
                    KR,
                    Patrick A.



                    Originally posted by John_Koorn View Post
                    Hey Patrick,

                    I have a similar setup to yours. It's a 4 x #18 4T connected to a 24v 200W panel (which only puts out a max of about 100w). I am using a 34,000uF 50v cap bank as the primary. Currently I'm using it rejuvenate a 130Ah 12v battery.

                    The difference is I'm not using the cap diode mod, so I see the voltage on the cap bank swing from a few volts in low light to about 42v in full sun. I'm interested in how you are using the mod to regulate the cap voltage. Would you mind scratching out a schematic on that part of the circuit for me? Apologies if you already posted it and I missed it.

                    Just to add, I find with my setup if I tune the base resistance for high input voltage and lower current it will charge better in both low light and full sun. For example, if I tune for 40v at 1A it charges better than if I tune for 20v at 2A.

                    John K.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      So when you slave a coil like that, assuming it's the same size, are you essentially increasing the amount of current you can push? Is there an effect on the amplitude of the voltage spike?

                      Is there also an increase in overall impedance as those coils work in unison, or do they each have their own independent impedance that you have to match?

                      Just trying to understand exactly what happens when you move from one coil to 2 or more..

                      Originally posted by BobZilla View Post
                      Hi YVes,

                      Those are good questions. The main reason I used the two coils instead of one is simply because I already had them. They came off of a two coil wheel I had running that I upgraded to a single coil. Now because of them I do plan to try some unusual stuff though. Notice they are pointing in at each other ( top to top)? That was not by chance. That part of the experiment will come later but it is secondary, because I have two I can play with them but the real answer is just because I had two.

                      For the triggers I am only using the one on the left at the moment. The coil on the right is only slaved in. If you look closely you will see the last two wires (far right) are not connected to anything, that is the other trigger wire. I have thought about putting a bridge on that one and maybe filling a cap, or I could put it in series/parallel with the other trigger for different effects on the circuit but for now it is not doing anything.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Branch the transistor bases are all connected to the same trigger, the emitters are all parallel, the collectors are parallel but after the diode. So basically each power wire is it's own feed to the collector of each transistor (not parallel) but the reverse polarity where the spike shows up is parallel to the charge pos because of the diode rectifying that direction.

                        So when you slave a coil like that, assuming it's the same size, are you essentially increasing the amount of current you can push? Is there an effect on the amplitude of the voltage spike?
                        Yea we are increasing the amount of current we can push but that is secondary. The real reason for doing it is to harvest more spikes from the added wires/transistors. If you think of it in basic terms all we are really doing is switching primary power from C to E, it's just a switch. When we open the switch the field collapses and the spike appears which we have given a path out the diode on the collector. Adding more and more does mean we can use more power but it doesn't have a direct correlation in my point of view. I can run my 4 tranny SS at 1 and a half amps just like this on is if you follow me. The differeance would be the amount of saturation we are inducing across the coil.

                        To put it another way
                        1500ma divided by 4 is 375ma per transistor
                        1500ma divided by 8 is 187.5 per transistor

                        I have not increased the current by using 8 so that is not the primary difference between the two, but I do now have 8 spikes instead of 4.

                        Of course it is all intertwined in the end so it depends on how you look at it. If I wanted to pull say 8 amps because I have a huge bank to charge well 4 trannies won't handle that will they so then I would say yes I am doing it to increase my current LOL ,, see what I mean it's all how you look at it really.


                        Now what I was more speaking about to YVes is the magnetic field in space around the machine, not the circuit. Questions such as what if you put them SNNS or SNSN or NSSN or NSNS or at 45 degress or 90 degrees,, on and on but because there are two instead of just one it opens a lot of questions that could be pursued. We are working from the magnetic field and I'm sure things could be done to manipulate outcomes, well not sure but curious.

                        Guys that first run is about done. I will get the charts and whatnot and post that up in a bit..
                        Last edited by BobZilla; 05-28-2014, 02:27 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Thanks Patrick, I'll have a play with it over the weekend.

                          I only have one 24v panel - it has an Voc of around 42v. I tried to explain that if I tune the base right, in full sun the panel hardly even sees the load even though on the meters I'm pulling about 80W out of it. At this setting I'll still get about 13v into the cap bank primary when the clouds come over.

                          At full sun nothing gets hot, I don't even have heatsinks on the trannys.

                          John K.


                          Originally posted by min2oly View Post
                          Hi John,
                          here it is click me
                          Re solar you need to balance the primary cap w/ the oscillator cap. once in place you will hear it shift gears all day long depending on what's allowed through to the panel. you must have two of those 24v in series to get 40v to the primary cap?
                          I've never ran this mod higher than 18volts...
                          KR,
                          Patrick A.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            bob or put side by side north up or north up south up a thought
                            guy

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Run Update:

                              Ok that first run is completed and I shot a video of me checking in on it a few times while it was running, making comments if anyone wants to see that it will be posted below.

                              Reminder of what we are looking at on this run. I started with two identical batteries which were the walmart "109AH @ 1A" deep cells. I would guestimate these are about 50AH or so on a c20 @ 3.5A but who knows, maybe later we can run the CBA on them.

                              We did not get a 1 to 1 on this Run, not even close. I put a second primary in to finish the job. The run was done at 1.5A pull on the primary throughout the whole run. I adjusted once and you can see that just before I switched the primary out. It had drifted about 100ma because of the voltage drop so I compensated, other than that one time the resistance was not touched.

                              Here are the charts:
                              Run1_Charge.jpg

                              Run1_Primary.jpg


                              And the video:
                              https://files.secureserver.net/0sFkzHMfZwP8DK

                              Over all I am happy with the performance of the charger so far. Next I am going to recharge that first primary at a 3A draw rate. I think the machine does need a bit more on the draw that 1.5A , maybe not 3 but who knows. I am bringing you guys along for the ride with me, remember I just built this thing and this was the first full run I ever did on it.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Bob
                                good video don't forget Pats cap-diode trigger
                                be for i try it has anybody tried putting a FWBR on the trigger ,don't want to do it on my 4 coil , a few more reasons to get the butler [a vanilla ssg] out

                                Comment

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