Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Plasma Ignition | Plasma Jet Ignition

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • I don't want to give away your work-around until you officially announce and publicly presented it, but I'm not talking about the current going in one plug and exiting the other in that kind of a loop.

    I'm referring to what you posted earlier in the thread around Sep-Nov regarding + in parallel, and - to ground. I'm sure you know the "parallel law" of old electrics - HV for plugs fired in parallel will be same as source for each plug - gap-resistance not, so most RE & current might go to gap with LEAST resistance, according to that "law"... Parallel Firing of Spark gaps has one unique feature in that in Radiant mode the 'Voltage is Split' but with the nature of Current like distribution at each plug, so the more you add spark plugs the more is Splitting/ Additional Plasma burst. in the Conventional senses this would get weaker unlike when you are Radiant mode discharging them. in conventional mode Current is result and Voltage is the Cause. in the Radiant its the reverse but with a Reversed definition:'Voltage Burst is the result of Current mode Geometry'(Parallel)


    Does the discharge speed of Murakami Method clocked for HV at 10ns and LV at 100 us by Mark McKay in Gray Replication thread, OVERCOME this?
    Last edited by Faraday88; 06-08-2015, 04:36 AM.
    'Wisdom comes from living out of the knowledge.'

    Comment


    • Thanx Faraday88, please check if I understand your answer:

      Parallel
      Firing of Spark gaps in Radiant mode the Voltage 'Split' but with the nature of Current.

      The more spark plugs you add the more is Splitting/Additional Plasma burst but don'tget weaker like conventional current discharge.

      Voltage Burst is the result caused by Current mode Geometry (Parallel)

      So will the gap with the higher resistance pull more voltage, and therefore will have larger voltage burst?

      Why I'm asking is that on my current car, 2010 Hyundai Atos, firing 2 NGK-R spark plug in series per OEM coil, I connected one Stromberg high frequency spark converter in each spark plug wire and it fired straight through the insulation of #3, making both plugs 2 nd 3 miss-fire.

      So if even OEM fired HV parallel per plug pair, if one spark plug wire dies the other should still fire. And a 4 cylinder engine can run with one piston not firing

      But not if it still is stupid standard series plug-paired wasted spark ignition.

      So in 'radiant mode' will the gap with the higher resistance pull more voltage, and therefore will have larger Voltage/Plasma burst?
      Last edited by Willem Coetzee; 06-08-2015, 01:38 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Willem Coetzee View Post
        Thanx Faraday88, please check if I understand your answer:

        Parallel
        Firing of Spark gaps in Radiant mode the Voltage 'Split' but with the nature of Current.

        The more spark plugs you add the more is Splitting/Additional Plasma burst but don'tget weaker like conventional current discharge.

        Voltage Burst is the result caused by Current mode Geometry (Parallel)

        So will the gap with the higher resistance pull more voltage, and therefore will have larger voltage burst?
        Still not totally sure if I understand you.

        But if the gaps are in series with a normal wasted spark ignition, the one on the exhaust port will only be a few thousand volts so most of the energy will be at the compression stroke plug with the highest dielectric resistance to overcome.

        For example...



        If there are gaps in parallel and assuming all gaps are perfectly equal and the resistance from source to the gap is the same, then everything will be divided between the gaps - voltage and current. The same as Faraday's explanation if I'm understanding him correctly. If one gap gives you a big plasma burst, 5 gaps will give you 5 plasma bursts around 1/5 of the discharge at a single gap. I don't know if it will really be linear like that, but I think that is the idea.
        Attached Files
        Aaron Murakami





        You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete. ― Richard Buckminster Fuller

        Comment


        • Hi Cotzee,

          So in 'radiant mode' will the gap with the higher resistance pull more voltage, and therefore will have larger Voltage/Plasma burst?
          Higher Resistance equating with Higher Voltage is the Symmetrical way for a Capacitive Coupling which is the Spark Gap (Capacitor that it forms between its electrodes) had it been Inductive Coupled system than what you say is correct i.e High-Resistance is proportional to High-Voltage something like what Stanley Meyer did in his Injector plug VIC.
          hence, the Voltage Burst is a result of Low Resistance at one exterme node of the Parallel array of spark plugs and High-Resistance at the other exterme node, this way it flipps(Invereted) the Normal Maths for Voltage/ Current/ Resistance equation.
          [B]hope you understand this explanation.[/B]

          Hi Aaron,
          f there are gaps in parallel and assuming all gaps are perfectly equal and the resistance from source to the gap is the same, then everything will be divided between the gaps - voltage and current. The same as Faraday's explanation if I'm understanding him correctly. If one gap gives you a big plasma burst, 5 gaps will give you 5 plasma bursts around 1/5 of the discharge at a single gap. I don't know if it will really be linear like that, but I think that is the idea.
          Its not the normal Current division between the number of plugs used that is at play! this way it would certainly get diminshed at one point. its the Current Geneartion(in the form of Voltage Burst) as a result of this geometry when Radiant excited.so when done in Radiant mode, it would essestially give you 5 x5 = 25..... that is all combined !!!

          Rgds,
          Faraday88
          Last edited by Faraday88; 06-08-2015, 09:42 PM.
          'Wisdom comes from living out of the knowledge.'

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Aaron Murakami View Post
            Still not totally sure if I understand you.
            Right, I understand series RE discharge, and now also understand parallel RE discharge a bit better.

            In a wasted spark setup for 4 cylinder inline engine, with 2 w/s coils, and 2 spark plugs per w/s coil, if all controllable variables are equal (wire-R, plug-R, gap size, V-source, head as common ground mass where spark plugs bolt into)...

            The main variable is gap-R in spark plug pair, due to one of the pair being fired having densely compressed gas mix in it, and the other with hotter less-dense combusted exhaust gas mix in it...

            When Murakami Ignition HV split between the 2 spark plug centers each connected to coil HV Positive (+), according to the explanations (F & A) voltage split between them in ratio to their gap resistance differential:

            - compression cycle gap gets higher V-value.
            - exhaust cycle gap gets lower V-value.

            DOES the LV Negative (-) discharge from ignition coil cap going through common head grounding to each spark plug base in the pair bolted into the head, now also splits in gap resistance differential with...

            - most LV going to higher V-value spark gap?

            - least LV going to lesser V-value gap?
            Last edited by Willem Coetzee; 06-08-2015, 10:01 PM.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Willem Coetzee View Post
              Right, I understand series RE discharge, and now also understand parallel RE discharge a bit better.

              In a wasted spark setup for 4 cylinder inline engine, with 2 w/s coils, and 2 spark plugs per w/s coil, if all controllable variables are equal (wire-R, plug-R, gap size, V-source, head as common ground mass where spark plugs bolt into)...

              The main variable is gap-R in spark plug pair, due to one of the pair being fired having densely compressed gas mix in it, and the other with hotter less-dense combusted exhaust gas mix in it...

              When Murakami Ignition HV split between the 2 spark plug centers each connected to coil HV Positive (+), according to the explanations (F & A) voltage split between them in ratio to their gap resistance differential:

              - compression cycle gap gets higher V-value.
              - exhaust cycle gap gets lower V-value.

              DOES the LV Negative (-) discharge from ignition coil cap going through common head grounding to each spark plug base in the pair bolted into the head, now also splits in gap resistance differential with...

              - most LV going to higher V-value spark gap?

              - least LV going to lesser V-value gap?
              Hi Coetzee/Aaron,
              Can one of you explan me what is a 'Wasted Spark'? its fundamental at this point to me..
              Rgds,
              Faraday88.
              'Wisdom comes from living out of the knowledge.'

              Comment


              • What do you mean by ordinary or symmetrical discharge of the battery? I don't think there is anything ordinary about creating a negative resistance path in series with a battery where the current is sucked out instead of it pushing into a positive resistance. Actually, I don't believe the current comes from the battery anyway... the battery is just a potential difference and the voltage flow comes from polarized aether at the terminal and over the wire/gap and the electron current comes from the copper wire or gap itself. I just had a epipany about how to explan this and the fact that JB rightly calls it as an 'Antenna of some kind' (i remember he states this in one of the Keelynet files)
                in fact a Capacitor is used to 'Induce' the Inside of the Battery on the Outside very much like an Antenna that receives Signals on to it.
                Indeed the Inside of the Battery is the Negative Resistance that is an Inverted electric Dipole, in the bedini process we increase this Negative resistance so that a Positive resistance when meets this will deliver higher power at it. while in the Gray System its the Capacitor that brings this Negative Resistance 'outside' like an Antenna on to the Load to Power it..
                Last edited by Faraday88; 06-09-2015, 03:18 AM.
                'Wisdom comes from living out of the knowledge.'

                Comment


                • Hey Aaron.

                  Please forgive me for not responding sooner as I have been very distracted with a LOT of other priorities I want to complete this summer while the weather is good.
                  The generator is the cheapest, half way decent four cycle generator I could find on amazon.
                  See: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KQD5ZX8

                  It is a Briggs & Stratton PowerBoss 30627 with 79CC engine and is rated for 1150 watts.
                  And it does appear to be very similar in design to the generator featured in this HHO experiment-
                  http://pesn.com/2010/12/25/9501743_A...g_in_elevator/

                  I have not done anything with the carburetor yet but IF this thing is to operate on water; I will likely have to drill the main jet out one or two sizes larger.

                  Thank you for your interest and as always; have fun experimenting.

                  Kindest regards;

                  }:>


                  Originally posted by Aaron Murakami View Post
                  I like your work - very clean and thanks for shooting the vids in good quality!

                  What is your exact generator and have you done any mods to the carb to be able to adjust it?

                  I just cut these plugs down to put in my Subaru EJ25 engine. It's wasted spark but I have a solution. Because of the conference, I haven't had much room to do anything else, but I hope to at least be able to show the whole thing by then.

                  (will post pics of plugs when I figure out why I can't upload it)
                  Basically just cut the ground strap level with the tip of the center electrode.

                  Comment


                  • Another video from Scorch's laboratory

                    Hello all.

                    Please forgive my month long absence as I have been distracted by many other priorities I am attempting to complete this summer while the weather is good and in between all the rain we've been getting this spring. Including landscaping, building repairs and vehicle upgrades including converting a step van from automatic to manual transmission, repairing and preparing an old travel trailer for sale, preparing for a large yard sale as well as a lot of work that needs to be performed on my turbo-diesel motorcycle that was just delivered this spring after nearly FIVE years of being built at a bike shop. . .
                    See: http://www.furaffinity.net/view/16726910/ (see gallery for more images)

                    Go figure. I paid a LOT of money for a "professional" bike builder to build this thing and yes, it APPEARS to be very nice but mechanically speaking; the bike that was delivered to me is BARELY road worthy. Just goes to show that if I want it done RIGHT then; I MUST do it myself!... So I am now REBUILDING that which I already paid to be built. . .

                    That is all for now and haven't done a thing with the plasma ignition since memorial day but I do intend to get more work done eventually.

                    Kindest regards;

                    }:>

                    Comment


                    • so out of curiosity, where did u get the Diesel motor? what is it out of? a Daihatsu?

                      Tom C


                      experimental Kits, chargers and solar trackers

                      Comment


                      • Hi, I have any plugs with 0 kOhm and any with 4 kOhm
                        plugs.jpg

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Faraday88 View Post
                          Hi Coetzee/Aaron,
                          Can one of you explan me what is a 'Wasted Spark'? its fundamental at this point to me..
                          Rgds,
                          Faraday88.
                          Faraday88,

                          The secondary windings on a wasted spark coil pack are isolated from the primary. When it fires, the HV + goes over one gap of a plug to ground and from ground to the center electrode of another sparkplug back to the coil. That is how it completes the loop. One plug will be on the compression stroke and one will be on the exhaust stroke. The firing of the plug on the exhaust stroke does nothing so is considered a wasted spark.

                          The car companies use this to cut down on the number of parts for the ignition system so they save money and there is less maintenance.



                          Whichever plug fires HV+ is always positive and whichever plug fires HV- is always negative. So the positive HV plug will have the center electrode wear down from the current bombardment and the negative HV plug will have the ground strap wear down from the current bombardment, which moves from the center electrode to the ground.

                          There are advantages and disadvantages to this kind of system, but it is very common on a lot of vehicles on the road today.
                          Attached Files
                          Aaron Murakami





                          You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete. ― Richard Buckminster Fuller

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Scorch View Post
                            I have not done anything with the carburetor yet but IF this thing is to operate on water; I will likely have to drill the main jet out one or two sizes larger.
                            Thanks - if you want to drill out the jets are you thinking of literally putting liquid water through that jet into the engine?

                            I want to modify my carb so I can have it completely variable so I can turn down the fuel to nothing if possible.
                            Aaron Murakami





                            You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete. ― Richard Buckminster Fuller

                            Comment


                            • It's a Daihatsu built Briggs & Stratton "Vanguard" brand model MD950DT 3 cylinder turbo diesel 950CC engine that I ordered through tulsa engine warehouse web site.
                              And yes, is basically the same engine that was used in early Daihatsu diesel cars.

                              Spec sheet-
                              www4.briggsandstratton.com/miscpdfs/RNT/vanguard_3lc.pdf

                              This engine was purchased years ago and as near as I can tell; is no longer being offered possibly due to ever increasing EPA regulations that are causing many diesel engine designs to be regulated out of existence in favor of highly sophisticated (and less reliable) electronically controlled "common rail" systems.

                              I originally wanted to use a Kohler 3 cylinder air cooled diesel engine but even back then, it was no longer available due to "tier 4" EPA regulations.

                              In a world where the EPA claims that it's "illegal" to reprogram our vehicle computer to allow our engine to run more efficiently on an alternative fuel (such as HHO) and with far less toxic emissions; it certainly appears that TRUTH is far stranger fiction...

                              Why does the EPA claim it's illegal to reprogram a vehicle for better efficiency and less emissions?

                              Remember this character?
                              He said the EPA wouldn't even talk to him...



                              And yes, this is on topic because even a GEET engine (and our planet) could certainly benefit from a plasma ignition system and some say these reactors actually are generating a plasma in some form.

                              Kindest regards;

                              }:>


                              Originally posted by Tom C View Post
                              so out of curiosity, where did u get the Diesel motor? what is it out of? a Daihatsu?

                              Tom C

                              Comment


                              • Yes; this is my ultimate goal.

                                To use as much of the existing original equipment with as little modification as possible. Such as drilling out the original main and idle jets for a fuel that is 'thicker' or has higher surface tension than gasoline and so the original carburetor and speed governor may still be used. As well as off-the-shelf parts such as auto parts.

                                And I do recommend studying carburetion systems as much as possible.

                                For example; some might believe the single "mixture" screw found on many lawnmower engines is controlling the mixture of the main jet when in fact; it is merely an idle mixture adjustment.
                                And the main jet is actually a fixed specification still allowing fuel flow even when the idle mixture is turned all the way in. Which, BTW can easily damage the needle and/or seat if one not very careful.
                                Here is a pretty good explanation of how a diaphragm based, fuel pumping carburetor might work including those found on many lawnmowers where the carburetor is mounted above the fuel tank: www.lazair.com/HL.htm

                                If the carburetor only has one mixture screw per barrel, this is merely an idle mixture adjustment. As compared to a chainsaw engine which may have both idle (low) and main (high) mixture adjustments.
                                But even these might be limited by a "main jet" that still has to be modified or changed in order to use an alternative fuel or merely a change in altitude which is why aircraft carburetors have adjustable mixture controls.

                                If you desire adjustable fuel/air mixture on your Subaru; just go find an old Aircraft carburetor on Ebay.
                                www.ebay.com/itm/261937929813

                                And motorcycle carburetors are interesting in terms that they do use a moving "atomizer" needle valve in conjunction with the main jet.
                                I discovered a really good, step by step tutorial about how these carburetors function here-
                                http://www.ducatimeccanica.com/dello...ellorto_1.html

                                Ignition systems are one thing but fuel control systems can be pretty complex.
                                www.powerjets.co.uk/Viper%20Fuel%20System.jpg

                                Kindest regards;

                                }:>


                                Originally posted by Aaron Murakami View Post
                                Thanks - if you want to drill out the jets are you thinking of literally putting liquid water through that jet into the engine?

                                I want to modify my carb so I can have it completely variable so I can turn down the fuel to nothing if possible.
                                Last edited by Scorch; 06-21-2015, 10:47 AM.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X